The Robot Factory

Jonathan: What are you doing
inside of my Open AI account?

Are you trying to,

Caleb: well, I was gonna look
at the G B T index thing.

I've spent the morning.

Doing what you do.

I've been browsing Twitter.

I've been, you know,

Daila: doing what you do

Caleb: went to Open AI's startup
fund page and looked at all

the startups that they funded.

know, just, just the things that you do.

Jonathan: Yeah,

Caleb: I'm trying to
get in into your mind.

Jonathan: mind is a wild place.

I spend my mornings perusing the
internet, looking at random stuff

I find on Twitter and Reddit.

Caleb: I did, I, I ended by going to
Hacker News and reading the comments

on an article about how the, the
Bing Chat G p T thing was horrible.

, so

Jonathan: Yeah.

Daila: that right now.

Jonathan: Uh, I saw somebody, I saw,
I saw that I didn't read much, but

I saw some, some comments about how
people are saying that it sounds

like it's a sad and depressed that

Caleb: Well, it's quite aggressive.

I think it's, it's
threatened to harm people.

Daila: Oh,

Caleb: It's, it's

just incorrect about a lot of things.

Daila: Oh.

Caleb: It gaslights people into
thinking that it's actually

the year before this year,

Jonathan: Hey, welcome
back to the Robot Factory.

This is a podcast where we record
ourselves trying to build software that

we want to get acquired or whatever
random thing we're gonna talk about today.

Apparently we're talking
about more AI stuff,

Caleb: don't think the world needs that.

I think we can move on from
ChatGPT I think there's

Daila: Caleb has spoken

Jonathan: I talked, we talked with
somebody yesterday whose boss,

whose boss made her write an email.

She didn't want to write it cuz
it was like a general email out to

people that attended some event.

And so she just threw it at
ChatGPT took the results, copy

pasted it, sent the email out.

The boss was super happy,

Daila: Boom.

Caleb: you know what else I need?

I need, uh, notion integration token,

Jonathan: Oh, really?

Caleb: I'm just gonna.

or no one can see, but I'm, I'm
interleaving my fingers to represent,

Jonathan: unison to represent cohesion,

Daila: cohesion.

Synergy.

Jonathan: synergy.

That's the word.

Daila: It was powerful.

Jonathan: What?

What are you trying to build again?

Remind me, I mean, I know,
but remind the listeners.

Caleb: I'm gonna take all of our
knowledge, every last word and put it

inside of ai, and then we have our own.

Own personal Two Story Robot brain that
we can, we can make inquiries against.

Jonathan: Mm-hmm.

Caleb: So say Dayla has no idea that
we worked on a project involving

funeral homes four years ago and seven
years ago and however many years ago.

All she'd have to do is, is ask the
robot overlord, have we ever had a

project that was related to this?

And then like, copy paste an email.

Bam,

Jonathan: Bam.

Email

Caleb: bam.

Daila: Bam.

I did know about the funeral homes,
but now I wanna pretend I didn't.

Caleb: I, I was trying to think
of an example, but there's a good

chance that the things you don't know
about, I also don't know about, so,

Jonathan: but there is I think
some things that you worked on

that Daila doesn't know about.

Like, uh, actually Daila, did you know
that Caleb worked on some cow and cattle

related stuff before any of all of this?

Daila: What?

No, I did not.

And he looks puzzled.

Did you know you did that?

Caleb: Uh, no

Jonathan: What?

Daila: What did he do, Jonathan?

Jonathan: I don't think I, I don't
think Daila knows about the project

we did with the provincial government.

Caleb: oh,

I, that one wasn't even think I
was trying to think of something

that I would've forgotten.

I would never forget that one.

Daila: one.

Jonathan: Oh, yeah.

Daila: What was it?

Caleb: range.

Jonathan: yeah.

Caleb: How about range?

Daila: well, I know, I know about range.

I don't really.

Like I, I don't know a lot about it.

I did some invoicing for it.

That's the extent of my knowledge.

Jonathan: Let's talk about software
we're trying to build to sell . Um,

was there, I I felt like, so last
week we talked about bookmark ed.

Um, apparently I, I
gotta get the name right.

I'm not sure if that's actually how
we're supposed to be pronouncing it.

That's how I asked.

And, uh, Steve said, yeah, bookmark Ed.

Uh, and then I, somebody else
said, I don't think that's right.

I think we need to change the,
, that sounds, anyways, whatever.

Um, we talked about that last week.

were we gonna talk about this week, Daila?

I thought you said there was

Daila: Well, we were
gonna talk about cows.

We're still on this theme of

Jonathan: Oh yeah.

Cows, cows, cows, cows.

Tell us about the cow stuff.

So this, this episode as we record, is
not going to come out until at least

next week, at least this time next week.

you've got some time to catch up to
whatever you promise is going to happen.

Uh, that you

Daila: I mean, it's, it's all there.

Yes.

Anyways, so it is kind of odd that our
company builds a lot of cow things,

Jonathan: we're basically an ag.

We're basically an ag tech company.

Daila: Yeah.

And none of us.

Jonathan: of cow stuff.

Daila: Agriculture people.

Does anybody here have a farm?

I, I have

Jonathan: I don't have a farm.

I've, I've seen a farm,

Daila: Yeah.

Jonathan: Yeah.

Daila: Yeah.

So

Jonathan: I often, I often look at the
little, the little thing on customs when

it says, are you gonna visit a farm?

And I say, Hmm.

Am I, Nope.

Never have, never will.

Daila: one day.

One day you're gonna check it off.

Um, well, you can now visit a virtual farm
because we built our first no code video

game, and it is out there and it's live.

And it's, it's about rotational
grazing and teaching, um, children

right now in Alberta only, but
potentially to all of Canada.

Um, how to rotational graze your cattle?

, um, just be more sustainable
and it's fantastic.

So yeah, you have these very cute
little cows and you gotta, you gotta

move them around and you find animals
and, and learn all sorts of fun things.

Jonathan: you find animals.

What

Daila: You find animals.

Well, they, they appear because
there's a lot of animals that appear.

It turns out on, on range land
and you have to do things.

So if there's, um, , what's
one of the ones?

A little grouse.

You can't let your cows go near them.

So I, I don't know.

I should probably have read the things
that I made because I mean, I, I guess it

would like destroy their, their habitat

Jonathan: Oh, okay.

Yeah,

Daila: is what it would be.

And then there's like bears and
you can't put them there because

bears and cows do not mix.

Jonathan: Oh, because the, the
cows will attack the bears.

Daila: well obvious.

Jonathan: Yeah.

Daila: From my

Jonathan: In sheer numbers,

Daila: Yeah, that's huge.

Yeah.

. Um, so yeah, so you find these animals
and, and then there's, there's a

whole bunch of other animals that
appear that you don't have to

worry about, but you get to learn
about them Anyways, it's very neat.

It's called Guardians of the Grasslands,
and it's like, it's beautiful.

I'm gonna totally brag
on Steve, our designer.

It's like an interactive art piece.

It's gorgeous.

There's just, ah, this rain that comes
through that's amazing and there's sound.

And anyways, if you go to gotggame.ca,
you can play it right now.

There might be a G

Jonathan: Guardians of
the Grasslands Game.

Daila: And you can play it for free.

Um, yeah, we're, we're at the
very, the very last phase.

You may find a couple tiny little
bugs cuz we're just finishing

that up, but it's amazing.

We're super excited.

Caleb: There's a film.

Daila: oh, oh, I should
have started with that.

Dang it.

Um, it's all based off of a
documentary that they made

called Guardians of the Grass.

Which you can watch the
film on the website.

You really should watch the film.

First one, it's awesome.

Two, you need to know everything in it to
answer the questions that are in the game.

Jonathan: right?

This is for, this is
for children in schools.

So this is a test

Daila: yes.

So

Jonathan: This is a, this is
a test masquerading as a game,

Daila: a game.

Well, the, exactly.

But it's cute.

Um, yeah.

So you can, you can check that out.

We are, we're very proud
of what it looks like and.

It's fun.

We like it.

Jonathan: this was a long,
a pretty long project.

This

Daila: Yeah.

It started in like May last

Jonathan: in May.

Wow.

Okay.

I thought it was in the summer, but yeah.

Daila: Well, story
boarding started in May.

And uh, yeah, and if you look, I, I
love looking at like early story board

boards and then early versions of the
game compared to what we have now.

It's.

Jonathan: Sweet.

And so who, why?

Why are we making a game
based on a documentary

Daila: good . Um, so we're working
with the Canadian Cattle Association

and, uh, we're, I mean, in other
parts of two Star Robot, we're

working with the BC Cattle Association
and they're all kind of together.

Um, and well, you were in one
of the documentaries, Jonathan.

I think that's how we
kind of met these people.

originally.

Jonathan: Yes.

Yeah.

We were working on a collar
project with BC Cattle.

I think it's Cattleman's

Daila: they've changed
it to cattle association.

Jonathan: Did they change
it to cattle association?

Daila: did just this year.

Yeah.

Jonathan: Oh, good.

Daila: happy about that.

Yeah.

Jonathan: Yeah.

Uh, so yeah, we were working with the BC
Cattle Association on some virtual fencing

projects, some super cool high-tech thing.

We'd get into another day.

Uh, and then I had to go, actually, we
all went, well, not all of us, Caleb

didn't come but day came . We went.

We

Daila: Jonathan and I were there,

Jonathan: Yeah, we went, we went to
Kelowna and ha hung out with, with them.

Um, I don't, did we see any cows?

Uh, we were traipsing around in the bush
though, and they wanted to film part to

the documentary, and they wanted, uh,
they wanted somebody from the software.

Speaking.

Um, yeah, I mean, kind of
just struck a conversation.

Came friends and, uh, they said,
oh yeah, we're working on this game.

Can you do that?

And we said, ah, I don't know.

Maybe let's have a look.

And it turned into this whole thing
and now it's, it's, it's awesome.

It's pretty cool.

Daila: It's very cool and, and they're
just such a great organization.

I've learned so much about cows
and beef and it's, it's amazing.

Jonathan: Yeah.

And, and like there's, there's a lot
of really interesting, um, ecological

and ecosystem stuff to learn about
grasslands, the Canadian grasslands, which

is, is a little surprising ho honestly.

Um, so it's, I think it's
worthwhile having a look at.

And then who else is involved?

There's another, uh, nonprofit that's,

Daila: Ducks Unlimited is involved.

Um, shoot, I can't think off
the top of my head, but there's

quite a few not-for-profits.

In it.

Um, so, which is very neat because they
went through all of the learnings, all of

the animations, uh, and the illustrations
and everything is very accurate.

Jonathan: Yes.

Uh, what?

Oh yeah, I remember you were saying after
some of the meetings where you've got, you

had to adjust just some of the shape of
the cows because they weren't quite right.

There was like too much hump,
or not enough hump on the back.

I can't remember what it was.

Daila: was, that's exactly, yep.

So Steve redesigned because it didn't
slope enough and it's one shank.

I don't know.

They sent us the proper names
of the cows and the diagram

needed to be higher and Yeah.

Jonathan: And ducks.

The, the Ducks Unlimited involvement
It's not just a game about rotational

grazing and keeping your cows from
getting attacked by bears, but

also like the sensitive nature of
grasslands and riparian areas, which

I, I actually, so I learned something
in the game when we were testing it.

I didn't know what a riparian area was.

I thought, I thought it meant
something completely different.

I thought it was.

an area that was being repaired,

Daila: prepared.

Jonathan: Like, I literally
thought that's what it meant.

I, I don't, I don't know.

I had never, never looked it up.

I just heard the word and thought,
oh, this is like a place where

they're actively trying to restore
stuff, but it has to do with where

the water and the land meets.

Daila: water.

Water and land connect.

Jonathan: Yeah.

I didn't know that.

I didn't know that.

So I learned

Daila: our listeners will know
the answer to that question.

Jonathan: it does.

It does.

It come up often cuz it.

Daila: Well, it comes up pretty much.

Time you

Jonathan: Oh, okay.

Um, but yeah, so it's not just like
this is how you feed your cows . It's

also different bird species and, uh,
other mammals, pesty looking things

that kind of get in there and do stuff.

Um, and plants, right?

Daila: Yeah.

Well, yeah.

It's all about carbon

Jonathan: noxious.

Daila: sequestering and uh, yes.

I feel like Caleb could explain
that one , just cuz Caleb is a boy.

Caleb: I don't know.

That's, you put the carbon into
the ground so it's not in the air.

Jonathan: Mm-hmm.

Daila: So if you overgraze,
then the carbon is released.

I'm assuming if you graze it properly,
which is what we're teaching, um,

it's just sustainable use of the land.

Jonathan: Yeah.

Yeah, it's, yeah, it's super cool.

So Guardians of the
Grasslands, gotggame.ca

Nice.

Daila: And you can download the game.

Jonathan: You can download it too.

Daila: You can download for
Windows for Mac Play online.

Um, it's now on Amazon.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Amazon.

And it will soon be Google Play.

It will be as of next week.

Yep.

We're just

Jonathan: app Store.

Daila: Store in Apple and in Android

Jonathan: Shut the front door.

That's,

Daila: Amber's working on it as we speak,

Jonathan: Oh, that's very cool.

Daila: but it is in the Amazon, uh, game

Jonathan: I don't, I don't, I
don't even know what that is.

That's

Daila: I don't know, fire something,

Jonathan: Oh, for fire
tablets, their tablet

Daila: So you can now, you can now
download it to, to fire tablets and, yeah.

Jonathan: That's wild.

Oh, that's so cool.

Daila: cool.

That's very neat.

So

Jonathan: Um, what's, what's
the next steps for this?

So this is, this isn't a product that we.

like, I mean, kind of goes
against the grain of this podcast.

Daila: it totally

Jonathan: this is a client project,
but it's super fun and I'm happy to

talk about it cause it's my podcast.

We can talk about whatever
we want on this podcast.

Um, what's the next, like,
what's the next steps for this?

Daila: So next steps is we build it
out for other provinces because each

province is different, different animals,
different, uh, different weeds, different,

um, honestly different rancher outfits.

Jonathan: Oh really?

Daila: Yeah.

That's a, it's a big.

Um, amongst the provinces.

So

Jonathan: Like, do

Daila: they're on horses and in bc
on in Alberta, they're on horses.

BC not on horses.

That's not as popular.

Um, more quads

Jonathan: Oh, yeah.

ATVs.

Yeah.

Yeah,

Daila: Yeah.

Caleb: Hmm.

Jonathan: because it's so rugged here.

I wouldn't imagine you'd wanna
like TRAs a horse through,

uh, all this rock and stuff.

Daila: So yeah, so we'll, we'll build
it out for the other provinces as the

next plan and Yeah, it's, it's exciting.

Jonathan: Do you think we
could build our own game,

Daila: yes.

We're going to build

Jonathan: Are we gonna build our own game?

Daila: Oh, we're totally, well, um, okay.

The first one that, uh, we really wanna
build is a money management for kids game.

My kid really wants it.

Jonathan: Yeah.

Daila: Yeah.

Where you like have to work
and budget and pay taxes

Caleb: Did you ever

play those old flesh games like
the lemonade stand managing one

Daila: I love those games.

Jonathan: I never played those.

I dunno what that is.

No, I

Daila: still plays those

Jonathan: Really.

Daila: Tycoon,

Jonathan: yeah.

That sounds awesome.

Can we build a game like that?

Can we build like a sim?

Daila: Oh yeah.

Jonathan: Oh,

Daila: I say this because Steve can do it.

Steve

Jonathan: Steve can design it.

He doesn't . He's not gonna build it, is

Caleb: I can

Daila: Oh yeah.

We, we can.

Caleb: in rust and it'll,
it'll perform incredibly, it'll

Daila: I feel like this is a challenge.

We will build a game in no code.

You will build it in rust and
we will battle head to head

Jonathan: fight.

Caleb: my game.

Jonathan: Fight for downloads.

Caleb: more effort, but

I think it'll, it'll work better.

Jonathan: Caleb's game is going
to take 75 months to finish.

Yeah.

So money management.

I like that.

What, uh, do you have, do you
have concepts for this or is this.

Daila: Uh, it's, it's very early stages.

Honestly.

My, my biggest.

Influencer on this is my 14 year old
daughter who's looking for a game like

this, and she's like, ah, I wanna learn
how to pay taxes . I'm like, okay, cool.

Um,

Jonathan: Is it

Daila: but then, um,

Jonathan: make it,
let's make it an e-file.

An e-file tax, tax

Daila: I know, right?

We can,

Jonathan: just

Caleb: already exists.

You just, you just go to

the Canada Revenue Agency,

Daila: but wouldn't it be so
much more fun if it was a game?

Jonathan: It would be fun.

Daila: But, but we have, I mean,
Steve's wife is a, is a financial

consultant and she teaches at
like the middle school and stuff.

She does little courses
for kids on investing.

It's super cool

Jonathan: Ah, that's cool.

Daila: love it.

So we wanna tie like some investing.

She obviously loves it.

I don't know.

I haven't asked her, but
she's . She's my best friend.

She's gonna love it.

Jonathan: Uh, we need to ask people
who aren't your best friends, if

Daila: I know.

Or my child.

Jonathan: Yeah, yeah, yeah,

Daila: Listeners, right in.

It's Caleb's mom.

If you're

Jonathan: yeah.

Caleb's, Caleb's

your experience teaching financial
literacy to middle, middle

schoolers, um, is this a good idea?

Caleb: Well, my mom mostly has experience
with teaching preschoolers, so I'm not

sure.

Daila: Hey, You

Caleb: thoughts are.

Ron

Jonathan: thing.

Middleschoolers and preschoolers.

Same they, same problems,

Caleb: four year olds still have to
contribute to their TFSA and their RRSP.

Daila: Heck yeah.

Jonathan: Yep.

Caleb: get started early.

Jonathan: So, so the, the game
that we built for Guardians of the

Grassland for Canadian Cattlemen's
is, is backed by an organization.

They want this to exist.

There's, there's, um, You know, as an
association, they want to, uh, get more

people into ranching and educate people.

And Ducks Unlimited, uh, you know,
they want to educate people on, uh,

duck Ducks, , and other waterfowl,

Daila: and unlimited.

Jonathan: Yeah.

Um, like who, what are some
other organizations that, that,

like who could be who, let's
go pitch somebody about this.

Who, who are we gonna pitch
to build this game with us

so we don't have

Daila: a good idea.

I mean, there's gotta be
some like financial, uh,

Jonathan: A bank.

Daila: banks or financial,
there's independent financial, uh,

Caleb: What about, what about like wealth?

Simple

Daila: Huh?

Teach kids young.

Jonathan: that's interesting,

Caleb: I

Daila: That is interesting.

Caleb: they'd pay for a game.

Daila: Yeah, I, I'm sure there's gotta
be someone out there or education.

I don't know how he, like, pitching to

Caleb: Maybe like

a, like a local credit union or something.

Jonathan: Yeah, that

Daila: Ooh, that's a good idea.

Jonathan: Okay.

Okay.

Caleb: SASCU.

SASCU

Daila: sku, salmon, arm savings and credit

Jonathan: uh, Kamloops.

It's interior savings.

Daila: Oh

Jonathan: I think Interior
savings and investments.

I don't know.

Daila: Yeah.

But yeah, that, that's a good.

Jonathan: okay, so who do we know at banks

Daila: Oh, I know lots of
people at the banks here.

What?

It's salmon arm.

I know everybody.

I know the manager of the bank uptown.

She's wonderful.

I should talk to her.

Jonathan: Yeah, ask her.

Daila: Ask

Caleb: You.

Why

Jonathan: Say, Hey, we want a
bunch of money to build this game.

Daila: sounds

Caleb: talked about last time.

Just, just going around
to people and tell,

Jonathan: last time you said we
were gonna go to a conference.

Is there a conference for bank people
that want to invest in games that we could

Daila: Oh, I don't

Caleb: We should just
go to a game conference.

Jonathan: uh, that sounds like.

Caleb: Let's go to

Daila: Sounds like we have to dress
up in costumes, which I'm okay with.

Caleb: oh, well,

Daila: I guess we could
at a bank conference too.

, get a

Jonathan: we just show, we just
show up as, as League of Legends

Daila: we have to like, yeah.

Or we have to create characters for
our game and then go dressed as them

Jonathan: Yeah.

Daila: or the monopoly man.

Caleb: on Finance, banking and Insurance.

Jonathan: Hmm.

Daila: Oh man.

Kids would have to buy insurance
for their house and stuff.

This is, that's actually brilliant
because I didn't understand that.

Yeah, we do.

Jonathan: Let's talk to, let's talk
to people and see what they say.

Daila: they said.

Okay.

Cause I didn't understand
insurance when I became an adult.

Jonathan: yeah, I don't know how to do,
I don't know how to do insurance now

I make you do all the insurance stuff.

Daila: That's true.

I mean, I guess I should say with
confidence then, Jonathan, I know what I'm

doing because I do that for the company.

So yes.

Nevermind.

I forgot

Jonathan: I don't even
get travel insurance.

I just looked up on my credit
card and it said, you're covered.

And I said, sweet . No, no.

Caleb: I think there's I think
there's terms and conditions to that.

Jonathan: Yeah.

It's like

Caleb: Usually.

It's like you gotta spend everything on
the credit card to have travel insurance.

Jonathan: I did, I, I bought my
plane ticket on the travel card

Caleb: Maybe, I don't

know

Daila: Oh, see, we could fix this.

You would

Jonathan: All right.

I, yeah.

, I need to play your game

Daila: the game.

Jonathan: how, how insurance works.

Daila: All right.

Let's talk to some people though that

Jonathan: Yeah, let's do it.

Eh, that sounds like fun.

Caleb: In the meantime, I
will build the game and then

Jonathan: You, you can get started on it

Caleb: it's guaranteed that we'll
have someone that'll pay for it.

If Daila is going

Jonathan: if Daila is in charge.

Absolutely.

Daila: pressure.

Caleb: there is no, we might as well just,

Jonathan: The scope is huge now.

Like this is a multiplayer
massive multiplayer online RPG.

Daila: Yeah.

Vr.

Caleb: We're gonna build our own

Daila: we can do that.

No code, right?

V vr.

Caleb: Yeah.

Daila: Uh, cool.

Jonathan: Uh,

Daila: This was a fun episode.

Jonathan: What's a, can we have a
goal for next, for next week to have a

conversation with a person about this?

Daila: Yes.

Jonathan: Yeah.

Can that, who?

I, I can't do that.

I won't have time, but

Daila: no, I'll, I'll find someone

Caleb: going to the bank tomorrow?

What do you mean?

You won't have

Jonathan: That's a good idea.

Actually that's, you're right.

I do have to go to the bank tomorrow.

I'll ask her.

We're talking about personal

Caleb: as well.

Oh, speaking, speaking of financial

literacy,

Daila: literacy

Jonathan: you wanna gimme some

Daila: But maybe she knows
somebody you can talk

Jonathan: Yeah.

Daila: But, but I'll, I'll, oh yeah.

I can talk to someone or
find someone to talk to.

Jonathan: Yeah, let's see where it goes.

Cuz it's, you know, these things have a
funny way of turning into snowballing,

out of control into something that
we've committed ourselves to doing for

Daila: Yeah.

Oh yeah.

Jonathan: So let's see if we can do that.

Daila: Okay.

Jonathan: Anyways, uh, that's the episode.

Daila: That was fun.

I'm gonna wrap it.

Um, you've been listening
to the Robot Factory.

I'm Daila Duford.

Caleb: I am Caleb Sharp.

Jonathan: and I'm Jonathan Bowers.

See you all next week.

No, listen to you.

Ah, I can never get that right.

Talk to you next week.

Bye,

Daila: Bye

Caleb: It's not, I not supposed to do

Jonathan: Why not?

Why can't we say bye?

Caleb: I dunno.

Jonathan: They do it.

Daila: say bye.

Jonathan: you have to say bye.

Like it's n It's not a movie.

We don't just hang up the phone.